NEF Single shots

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Mnshooter posted this 02 February 2008

I thought I would get this started as I like single shots.  There are two kinds of single shots, those I would like to have and cannot afford and those I can afford.  Through the years I have played with several of the New England Arms break opens and have good luck with them.  One I still keep is a 1871 Buffalo model in 45-70 with a 30 inch barrel.  The last one I looked at was a 30-30 model that I thought would make a good plinker and companion to carry on my 4-wheeler when I cut wood. They are tough as rocks.  Likely would be great for jacketed but I swear it had the micro-groove rifling.  As Marlin now owns this company I assume it is a Marlin barreling system.  While micro-groove rifling may not be all that bad I know some that would rather not use it for cast.  Just thought I would mention that.

Mnshooter

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CB posted this 02 February 2008

I just picked up one in 357 mag and as a bonus it came with a 44 mag barrel to boot. Haven't really had the chance to play with it much, yet.

The fellow I got it from is thinning out his herd and originally bought this to work up pistol rounds.

He didnt say whether it really was accurate, but knowing him he didn't keep a gun long if it didnt shoot cb's accurately. He has had this for a long time. I dont know if this is a model prior to the marlin takeover.

I am eager to see what it will do.

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pls1911 posted this 02 February 2008

Don't kid yourself... microgroove barrels shoot cast slugs just fine, so long as they're sized properly and hard.

All my Marlins do very well with any of the common flat nose gas checked designs, Lyman 311041 170grain, RCBS 180FNGC, or Seaco 160 grain.

My method is to cast, then heat treat, then run through a .310 sizer to seat the gas check and lube.

 

I've run these at 1900-2000 fps in IHMSA matches as well as through the Marlins hunting with very good results.

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Fred Sinclair posted this 02 February 2008

I'm told that the 30-30, 308 and 30-06 all start with the same 10” twist blank. I do not have a 30-30 yet but do have the latter two. The barrels look good, clean up good and most of all, shoot very well with cast. Fred

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CB posted this 03 February 2008

Hey Mnshooter;

Get a hold of Ranch dog, he has the trick for micro groove barrels shooting cast. Don't start out saying micro groove dosen't shoot cast well. he is a little touchy about that.

                                                                               Roy

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30-30 Wesson posted this 04 February 2008

I have 4 single shots, if you count a bolt action SS and a .52 cal Muzzleloader, one is pictured in my avatar and the other is an 1886 vintage Martini Henry that I've re-barreled in .303, making it a sort of Martini Metford and it is showing great promise.

My first center fire rifle was a .32-20 Winchester Low Wall, like the one I have now, so I have a soft spot for them. They fit beautifully into a saddle scabbard and usually point like a well trained bird dog. I like them alright and have 2 more in pieces that will be put together and get used one day. The Falling Block will be a Hornet and the Martini Cadet will be..........a......hmm  :coffee  need to think on that one.

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linoww posted this 04 February 2008

Fred Sinclair wrote: I'm told that the 30-30, 308 and 30-06 all start with the same 10” twist blank. I do not have a 30-30 yet but do have the latter two. The barrels look good, clean up good and most of all, shoot very well with cast. Fred

What are the bore and groove dimensions in the current .30 barrels? Does a “standard” .301 bore-ride nose fit them well enough?? Also,do you have to tinker with the fore-end bedding at all?

George

"if it was easy we'd let women do it" don't tell my wife I said that!

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Fred Sinclair posted this 05 February 2008

I mainly use 311299, 311284 and 314299 in everything 30 caliber I shoot. Most of my 311 molds cast .300 (lino) on the nose so I end up bumping nose diameters to .301 to .302. Most of my rifles, including the Handis, like these diameters as well as the larger .305 that my 314299 turns out.

The bore diameter of the 308 is just a tick larger than the 30-06 but both will allow  a .301 nose up to the first driving band with just a bit of interference. If I use the 314299 I just seat so the .305 nose is hard into the lands and still am able to close the action without a lot of trouble.

I'm not sure I can tell you much about fore-end bedding. I'm a sittin' down shooter and I rest the rifle on the action, just ahead of the trigger guard. Works well for me plus I can open and close the action without lifting the rifle off the bags. I have read that bedding is needed if you are using the fore-end for other than holding the barrel on.

Plan on FL sizing or indexing cases as barrel to breech fit is about what you would expect from a $230 rifle. Stocks are clubs and triggers are heavy but you still get a lot for the buck.

Fred

 

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linoww posted this 05 February 2008

Fred Sinclair wrote: I'm not sure I can tell you much about fore-end bedding. I'm a sittin' down shooter and I rest the rifle on the action, just ahead of the trigger guard. 

 

My friend has one in 223 that strings vertically.I'll tell him to try that and see if that helps.Good advice.I checked on the pricing for extra barrels from NEF. and they are only $87 ea. Now I might have to own one<G> I am wondering about the twist of their 22 Hornet barrels.Does anybody know??

 

George

"if it was easy we'd let women do it" don't tell my wife I said that!

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Mnshooter posted this 05 February 2008

Most of the NEFs i've seen do not have micro-groove 30 cal but I was wondering if they were not making a switch.  Before the sale to Remington, Marlin was starting to make a lot of rifles with Ballard rifling.  Those I have had with Ballard have shot pretty well with little fuss.  Had a micro-groove 45-70 a long time ago but really didn't know much about cast and never got it to shoot, but I think it was mostly ignorance.  My NEF 45-70 shoots just fine with cast and took a deer with the Gould bullet and BP.

Mnshooter

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CB posted this 05 February 2008

Of the few single shots I shoot and lever guns, they all shoot better like Fred says close to the action. If I can't get that far back, I go to the balance point and then back just a little so the rifle doesn't tip forward off the bags. I then rest my hand on the front rest bag and hold onto the rifle with my fingers best I can, with only light down pressure applied at the buttstock with my thumb. This has really worked well for me, but is really touchy to control.

My friend had two Handi rifles for pdog shooting, a 223 and a 22 Hornet. He finally got rid of both and is super, duper happy with his new Savage Varminters and his CZ in 22 Hornet. The CZ Hornet is a real shooter. Sometimes you get frustration for the buck, also.  :(

I had 2 Handi rifles in 22lr. The most miserable shooting things I ever had in my hands as far as accuracy. I lined one (it was brand new) and chambered it like I usually do with a Clymer Match reamer and it still only shot fair, where my other liner-jobs in about any bolt-action rifle shot accurately to match standards. I reamed out my other one with a 22 mag chamber thinking it'd be good and tight, but it don't shoot either. Was going to line it with a .17 liner to make a MachII but ran out of liners and just lost interest, rather shoot lead.

As far a single shot rifles, remember the falling blocks are a different breed than the break-open action single shot. The falling and rolling blocks are more inherently accurate than an open breech action rifle. Either will dropa critter, but accuracy for match competition is another critter......................Dan

 

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Fred Sinclair posted this 05 February 2008

George, the Hornet is 12” twist. Fred

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30-30 Wesson posted this 05 February 2008

Linoww,

It has been my experience that, on a single shot rifle that is fitted with a 2 piece stock, that the forend wood should be firmly attatched to the barrel and not be tight up against the action. On the little Martini's you should be able to slip a card between the wood and action and on ones where the wood goes into a recess there should be a space between the end of the wood and the end of it's recess. This should stop any vertical stringing. 

 

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R. Dupraz posted this 06 February 2008

I agree with 30-30 Wesson. I have found the same thing. When ever I stock a rifle with a separate fore end that's the way that I set it  up. I use a paper shim to get the clearance of a few thousands between the front of the action and the rear of the fore arm.

Also, with a rifle that has two attachment forearm screws, I'll take one out to prevent the screws from binding against one another when things heat up, especially during the summer. Shouldn't be a problem with the NEI guns with the single screw. 

I have noticed a marked improvement in the elimination of flyers with my Shiloh Sharps .45x2.4 after doing this. Particularly when the gun really gets hot in summer during a match.

I'm talking target guns here where a number of shots are fired in fairly quick succession and the guns don't really get a chance to cool much. Maybe not that much of an issue with a hunting rifle. However when wood and metal heat or cool, they're gonna  move some where. 

RD 

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Fred Sinclair posted this 06 February 2008

Hey RD, we're talking about “state of the artâ€? here.;)

 The Handi fore end has a spacer that attaches to the rear and acts as one half of the hinge for the break open technology. There is a female stud spot welded to the barrel and as fit by the factory the fore end is wedged between the stud and the action. The fore end screw just keeps the fore end from falling off which in turn keeps the barrel from falling off when the action is opened. Now if that ain't “state of the artâ€? what is.

 

All BS aside I have read about bedding that relieves the stud and then bedded as you and Tony described using a card. I'm sure if the fore end was on the bags or a sling was used bedding would be a big plus.

Fred

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R. Dupraz posted this 06 February 2008

Hi Fred:     :shock::D:D

Sounds similar to the old Stevens single barrel shotguns. Except for a spring in the forearms that keeps it jamed against the hinge. I have an old o/u double hammer .410 with that kind of arrangement. 

Being a s**ker for single shots and a perpetual tinkerer, always thought that if I would happen to run across one of those NEF rifles reasonable, I would take it. Maybe in 38-55 or a cal suitable for cast. Just to see what a guy could do with it. Have heard both extremes, can't hit a barn door with them or they do really well after some dinging around. Too cheap to take a chance on new so think I'll just wait and see. But I think that would change if NEF offered them in 25-20 Win.

 

RD 

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Fred Sinclair posted this 06 February 2008

R. Dupraz wrote: Sounds similar to the old Stevens single barrel shotguns.  

RD, you hit the nail on the head.

I would like to see some blanks offered by NEF but don't expect that will ever come to pass.

As a s**ker for single shots is any other rifle out there, that is not a break open, that shoots cast well, chambered for something smaller than 45/70 and that can be had for less than a grand.

Fred

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Ed Harris posted this 07 February 2008

Fred Sinclair wrote: As a s**ker for single shots is any other rifle out there, that is not a break open, that shoots cast well, chambered for something smaller than 45/70 and that can be had for less than a grand.

Fred

  I've had John Taylor build several barrels for me to fit my Beretta 412 folding shotgun.  These may not be of the Ferlach Guild quality but are entirely serviceable for the price range.  He also made .32 ACP and .32 S&W Long barrels to fit my old pre-war tiny action H&R .410 to give me options in a less than 4-1/2 pound walking gun.   WAY less than a grand even considering the original acquisition cost of the shotgun.

Taylor Machine 14119 Military Rd. E Puyallup, WA 98374

(253) 445-4073

http://www.johntaylormachine.com/>http://www.johntaylormachine.com/

73 de KE4SKY In Home Mix We Trust From the Home of Ed's Red in "Almost Heaven" West Virginia

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R. Dupraz posted this 07 February 2008

One of the countless projects that has been in my mind's eye is a quality small cal. break open single shot. One with a top lever that could be built in the Germanic or Austrian style. Probably in 25-20 Win.

I remember some years ago, TC sold a break-open single shot center fire rifle double set's I think. I have never seen one, then or since, even at gun shows. I don't think is was offered for very long, must not have sold well, I suppose. Does anyone here know about these guns or what they may be worth now? Seems to me, one of these would be an ideal candidate .

Kind of hijacking this here thread for a moment,

 

RD

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Ed Harris posted this 07 February 2008

R. Dupraz wrote: One of the countless projects that has been in my mind's eye is a quality small cal. break open single shot. One with a top lever that could be built in the Germanic or Austrian style. Probably in 25-20 Win. All it takes is money:

http://www.hendershots.net/gunRoomDetail.aspx?id=1867>http://www.hendershots.net/gunRoomDetail.aspx?id=1867

73 de KE4SKY In Home Mix We Trust From the Home of Ed's Red in "Almost Heaven" West Virginia

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R. Dupraz posted this 07 February 2008

Ed:

oooooooh  yeah !!!!!!!!!

Might be kinda hard to get it passed by the chairman of the board or should I say chairperson....

 

Thanks

RD

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