30 WCF Brass Life

  • 468 Views
  • Last Post 5 weeks ago
jimkim posted this 12 September 2019

Have any of you used a body die to load 30WCF? I'm trying to get a bit more life out of my cases. I have a 70 model 336, and it likes 0.311" to 0.312" bullets. I anneal my brass and I'm still(same either way) only getting three loadings per case. I believe the problem may be from the amount the neck is worked with each loading, and the neck diameter in the chamber. This is with both Win and Fed brass. With Rem I get four, before the neck splits. I have thought of skipping the sizing, and just using my seating die and FCD to load. I may end up rechambering the barrel or replacing it altogether.

Attached Files

Order By: Standard | Newest | Votes
45 2.1 posted this 13 September 2019

 I have thought of skipping the sizing, and just using my seating die and FCD to load. I may end up rechambering the barrel or replacing it altogether.
You don't mention your load levels or other pertinent things, but several people on the net do what you're suggesting. Another would be trying Lee Collect resizing dies. Just enough to hold the bullet when seated, then crimped. This alone should get you many more firings from minimal brass working.

Attached Files

  • Liked by
  • jimkim
GBertolet posted this 13 September 2019

Try the Lee Collet Neck Sizer die. Cases seem to last forever for me using this die.

Attached Files

  • Liked by
  • jimkim
Ross Smith posted this 13 September 2019

Have you checked head space? I had a 30-30 with horrible head space and it suffered case separation.

Attached Files

  • Liked by
  • jimkim
jimkim posted this 13 September 2019

I've had them split with 6.0gr RedDot under SAECO 630's, Ideal 308241's, 10.0gr Unique under RD311165's 311041's, 30.0gr IMR-4350 under the RD's and 041's, and 30.0gr IMR-4064 with the same bullets. The pressure level doesn't seem to make much a difference. It's very aggravating. I didn't have this problem with my 1991 model 336.

Attached Files

JeffinNZ posted this 13 September 2019

Sounds like your brass is being over worked.  My 6.5 Carcano is the same.  I have to anneal EVERY firing to avoid (mostly) split necks.  +2 on the collet die.

Cheers from New Zealand

Attached Files

  • Liked by
  • jimkim
admiral posted this 13 September 2019

I don't know what vintage your brass is but I find current production brass (Win, R-P, Fed) to be much lower quality these days. I have a private range and every fall I allow a few guys I know to check zero on their rifles for the upcoming deer season. These guys are strictly hunters shooting factory ammo out of bolt actions and levers. Their "range fee"  is they leave me the empty brass. So I collect a variety of 30-06, 270, 30-30, 243, 308, etc. I can't believe how many rounds have split necks from fired factory ammo. I don't even think the factory anneals this stuff after forming anymore.

Attached Files

  • Liked by
  • jimkim
Ross Smith posted this 14 September 2019

Have the primers backed out in any of these split cases?

Attached Files

BudHyett posted this 14 September 2019

Can you perform a chamber cast? This will give actual dimensions and a better understanding. You will need only to cast the neck and shoulder to get what you need. 

In the early 1990's, the factories for several years all produced bad brass n the sense it did not last long in reloading. Annealing helped, but not a full cure. 

If the chamber is worn, set the barrel back several threads. . 

Country boy from Illinois, living in the Magical Pacific Northwest

Attached Files

  • Liked by
  • jimkim
fa38 posted this 14 September 2019

  30-30 headspaces on the rim and if you set the shoulder back each time you size it will separate at the base.  Therefore, use your reloading dies to set up the cartridge to headspace on the shoulder of the case.

Attached Files

  • Liked by
  • BigMan54
  • jimkim
Ross Smith posted this 14 September 2019

fa38; you got it.

Attached Files

  • Liked by
  • jimkim
BigMan54 posted this 14 September 2019

 I use a Lyman 310 .30-30 Size Die. Since it only neck-sizes I have no problem with case necks cracking, no shoulder splits either. I use the neck expanding die for Cast Bullets. The 7/8x14 adapters are expensive now but worthwhile to get that little die into my RC, glad I bought mine a long time ago.

I was given 8 boxes of once-fired PMC brass from their Cowboy loads. Fifteen+ yrs, use them only for Cast Bullets.  Haven't lost one yet. 

I also have 100 REM-UMC .32 Win Spl cases that I necked down to use in my H&R Handi-Rifle for cast bullets loads. 

I have no idea how old these cases are or where I got them. But they just work, of course I load light cast only in Rifle. 

Partial or neck sizing is the best way I know to prolong case life.

 

 

Long time Caster/Reloader, Getting back into it after almost 10yrs. Life Member NRA 40+yrs, Life S.A.S.S. #375. Does this mean a description of me as a fumble-fingered knuckle-draggin' baboon. I also drool in my sleep. I firmly believe that true happiness is a warm gun. Did I mention how much I HATE auto-correct on this blasted tablet.

Attached Files

  • Liked by
  • jimkim
  • M3 Mitch
Fitzpatrick posted this 14 September 2019

I've been using 375 win. brass from star-line aneal and run through a full length sizing die the trim, for my win.model 94 I don't have to turn necks but the necks are thicker than factory brass and probably a good idea to work loads up for your rifle.

I have 20 pieces of brass I have reloaded 25 times and no signs of problems yet I do anneal the brass every other firing  and they are for cast bullet weighing 200 gr. pushed at 1800 fps. so not light loads  

Attached Files

  • Liked by
  • BudHyett
  • jimkim
durant7 posted this 5 weeks ago

To the OP, this is not what I have experienced.  My platform, range brass, just RP.  Trade with others to let them use FC and WIN I find and make everyone happy living off of range brass.  Cheap, frugal, learning, got lucky.  Don't know.  About 500 in use.  I load them and shoot them and put them in a bucket.  when I get down to 100 I start the process all over again.  I shoot Lever Action Silhouette and shoot them all and a tad each year.  But, I have been doing it for 10 years.  I bet some have been used 15 times and some less.  I have had one split at the neck.  Never did annealing.  Want to more to improve accuracy.  But have not.  

Marlin 336CB from the 80's.  I use 31146 at .311.  4198 but won't share how much.  Safety.  Not fast.  Got above 2,000 FPS at muzzle and things opened up.  

For me, I picked up a Redding neck sizer for accuracy, not for brass conservation.  In truth, the only part of the case i work is the neck as I use an expander from from a 32-20 RCBS Cowboy die set I picked up on the cheap.  it works to ensure I don't shave the bullets.  It works for me.  I do them all the same.  Small, minor, minimal neck re-working but more than I want.  As I pursue bench rest bolt gun accuracy from my lever gun, I have often wondered if I would get tighter groups with necks with known, annealed, neck tension.  To read your post about fighting NECK SPLITS.  Seems so odd to me.  You are not getting case separation so head spacing is not the issue.  No shoulder or case so FL sizing...I would not think is the issue.  Neck splits.  Maybe your annealing is not helping but making the issue worse?

I am sure we have all digested the many many articles and Utube how to's on annealing.  Unless you go to Tempilaq it is hard, IMO, to know what you are really doing.  

In close, I am sorry to read of your frustration.  I am enjoying the opposite if that is helpful.  Or encouragement.  I shoot = expand, neck size = compress, expand neck expander , kiss crimp a skosh, shoot and repeat.  All on the neck. No neck splits to speak of with range RP brass.  My two partners who shoot the FC and WIN are not having issues either.  I would have liked to gone with WIN but my supply or RP was greater than WIN when I started 10 years ago.  So now, my WIN buddy is happy and my FC buddy is happy.  I am stuck but happy with RP.

My quest, longer 30-30.  2.085" is what I wish I could find for my gun.  I sized some 38-55 down which gave me slightly more length for my chamber.  A lot of work and I did not see any real improvement in group.  My sample was too small to be meaningful.  Time is not on my side.  

I hope you find success.  I do enjoy the lowly 30 WCF.  Great platform to learn on.  Maybe some day I will graduate to something more exotic.  

Attached Files

jimkim posted this 5 weeks ago

No.

Attached Files

jimkim posted this 5 weeks ago

Have the primers backed out in any of these split cases?

No.

Attached Files

bushranch posted this 5 weeks ago

For a longer 30-30 case I start with new 32-40 cases rather than 38-55 . I have used both and the 32-40 makes a longer case and a better inside neck diameter . I trim to 2.090 . Winchester cases .

Rus

 

 

Attached Files

  • Liked by
  • jimkim
jimkim posted this 5 weeks ago

I was thinking about reaming the chamber or rebarreling it to 307 Win. I have friends that use 308 brass in their 307's. Since I rarely shoot anything but cast now, and only shoot my handloads, I'm pretty sure I'll never have pressure issues.

Attached Files

Close