#2 and #4 Remingtom Rolling Blocks

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  • Last Post 01 January 2009
JetMech posted this 16 December 2008

A local gun shop has a Remington #4 in 32 RF. I had inquired on another forum about converting it to 32-20 and was told that they will shoot loose in short order and that the only thing I could do would be to reline it to .22 and only shoot standard ammo in it because even high velocity 22 ammo will cause it to shoot loose.

My question is: is there a difference between the #2 and #4 as far as strength, and has anyone here done the conversion to 32-20 or H&R mag?

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Antietamgw posted this 16 December 2008

I made these same inquiries a couple years ago after reading what Frank DeHaas had done with the #4 RB. I had a couple actions and wanted to do something with them. I found a number of knowledgable folks on the ASSRA forum with experience rebuilding the RB's. The #2 would be fine for .32-20 and would be, by far, my first choice.. I wouldn't chamber any #4 for .32-20 though. The solid frame #4's are supposed to be fine for .32 S&W and Long. I'm working on 1 now and am going to chamber it for the .32 S&W Long or a slightly shortened Long cartridge so that the only factory round that would chamber would be the .32 S&W. I don't intend to load hot, I just want a quiet little rifle for small game and plinking. If the bore on the #4 you are looking at is good I imagine you could just re-chamber and convert the breech block to CF. Not sure what size bullet would be right for the converted RF. My frames were both takedown style. One of the fellas on the ASSRA forum, John Taylor I believe, mentioned that he had found that the takedown reciever could be threaded with a special size tap, 9/16X40TPI if I recall. I checked my recievers, found them of proper size and ordered plug and bottoming taps. I made up a jig to set the reciever up in a mill or drill press, centering the reciever ring. The tapping is done by turning the quill by hand. I threaded and fit a barrel from P14 Enfield Drill Purpose rifle that had an extremely good bore. I haven't chambered it yet due to time constraints and that it took awhile to find a floating pilot reamer at a good price. Very soon, I hope!  Lining the .32 to .22 isn't a bad idea though you may still need to relocate the firing pin. I've heard both ways. Happy tinkering!

Keep your plowshare and your sword. Know how and when to use them.

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RicinYakima posted this 16 December 2008

Dollar Bill,

A #2 is almost half again as big as a #4, being 1.1 inch thick and .8” barrel shank. I am working through the same issues now on a #2, see Gunsmithing Tips section.

Ric

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JetMech posted this 16 December 2008

Thanks, gents. Good info from both of you! I guess I just have to decide whether or not to start another project. Ric, I started following your thread on the WTB thread. Keep us updated on your progress. This is great stuff!

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BruceV posted this 16 December 2008

Here I am stuck at home with a case of the crud when lo and behold I find this thread and read about adventures in gunsmithing Rem. #2 and #4 RB rifles!  How about ya'll put up some pictures of the different stages of work?  It sounds fascinating!  Sincerely.  Bruce.

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RicinYakima posted this 16 December 2008

Bruce,

Here is the action I'm working with.

Ric

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4060may posted this 16 December 2008

RIC That's a nice one.

I'm not sure I would change the block

Fitting a new one would be better

What is the barrel length? 30?

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4060may posted this 16 December 2008

this is how much scale was on one of the No.2 in 22lr was.

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4060may posted this 16 December 2008

this was the electrolysis process I used sodium carbonate, a piece of angle,  and a battery charger

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4060may posted this 16 December 2008

This is the action when I was done, sanded a little I give this to my friend that made the block for me. He has singe surface ground it and started to drawfile the barrel we are going to learn how to re-line, pictures when we are done

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BruceV posted this 17 December 2008

Absolutely fascinating. Thank you for the pictures and explanation of efforts in cleaning and building your rifle. I knew that the Rem. RB action was chambered for large cartridges, both BP and smokeless. I should have known that Rem. would have produced a RB action for small rounds including the .22 LR. It looks to be very small and compact. I would think it would be idea for a small game rifle. I am sure many will follow your project with interest. Sincerely. Bruce.

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RicinYakima posted this 17 December 2008

Well, here is the bad news. VTI, the Uberti parts dealer, is out as that is a discontuned rifle and doesn't expect any more parts, ever. So, it is back to conversion or building a new block from scratch. Ric

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Antietamgw posted this 29 December 2008

I finally got around to taking a couple pics - not good ones but i'm still figuring this camera out. A #4 takedown action I've threaded and rebarreled is pictured next to a #2 (the next victim, as my doc is fond of saying). Also pictured are a couple tools I made up to set up the reciever for threading and a threaded mandrel to check the breech block face. The pic of the breech block shows the bushing installed and the breech block has been converted to centerfire. The reciever thread size is 11/16X40 TPI. I purchased a plug and bottom tap to do this. i need to finish the chamber, extractor and wood. I've done a few of these and one thing i'd strongly suggest is to make new screws before you start. Most of these guns have seen a good bit of use. New close fitting screws for the breech block and hammer make quite a bit of difference in the finished product. 

Keep your plowshare and your sword. Know how and when to use them.

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CB posted this 29 December 2008

Antietamgw wrote: I've done a few of these and one thing i'd strongly suggest is to make new screws before you start. Most of these guns have seen a good bit of use. New close fitting screws for the breech block and hammer make quite a bit of difference in the finished product.  I 2nd that recommendation. I've rebuilt two Stevens Favorites. Such rolling block actions need to be tight to function properly and accurately. May need .001"-.002” oversize diameter to make up for the worn hammer and block. Well worth the time...............Dan

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JetMech posted this 30 December 2008

Thanks for all the pics and info. I especially appreciate the electrolysis process, 4060may. I have a couple rifles that a friend had that went thru a house fire. The stocks were charred, but not badly. I've been contemplating hardness testing them but didn't want to spend hours trying to remove the scale to get to the base metal. The electrolysis process method looks like the key.

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RicinYakima posted this 30 December 2008

Antietamgw,

Great pictures. After you put the new bushing into the face of the block, did the center line come close to the main body of the firing pin? My #2 looks like the firing pin tip will be above the body of the main part, i.e. into the solid part of the block if I keep it at the same angle. I'm trying to figure out how to do it without filling the complete firing pin space and re-drilling at a steeper angle. The #2 was designed for a 50 caliber RF, so it is pretty steep up just to make 32 caliber. Remington had to have some way of doing this as they made it in CF calibers.

Ric

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Antietamgw posted this 31 December 2008

Ric,

This face on this breechblock was in bad shape when I got it. I think someone had also opened it up to suit about a 12d nail and some of the pitting on the face was quite deep. What I did was open up the firing pin hole to body diameter through the face of the block. I fitted a solid plug made of drill rod and silver soldered it in. The bushing was made and silver soldered in as well. I left  the plug  recessed just enough from the rear (where the hammer would strike it) to provide an  easy flat surface to locate the end mill to recut the hole for the body of the firing pin.. I'm sure the machinist-type guys would have a way to start that hole on the rounded surface but I'm just a wannabee machinist, so I looked for the easy way out. To hold the breechblock for milling, I used a spare drill press vise that has an open area under the jaws. I made a little jig to hold a small center and clamped it to the mill table, Just a small block with a hole drilled that matches the size of the center will do. I positioned the end mill to meet the center which is secured to the table. The face of the breechblock bushing was remarked and centerpunched, using the barrel, a small punch made to fit the bore and a piece of drill rod. I placed the center on the centerpunch mark of the breechblock, which is between the open vise jaws. The quill is lowered with the end mill on the little recess left above the soldered in plug. I locked the quill down with slight pressure to center the breechblock between the end mill and center on the table. The vise jaws were closed, attempting not to move the breechblock off the centerpunch mark. The vise was secured to the table and the setup checked half a dozen times or so. It worked out quite well but I'm sure there are many other ways to accomplish the same thing. Wish I had a pic, the explanation leaves a bit to be desired. After milling the body of the firing pin hole I made a drill bushing to fit before drilling through the breechblock bushing. My action started of as a .32RF(I think) so I didn't need to relocate the firing pin much to change it to CF. The breechblock was so pitted and battered up I didn't bother to see whether I could just enlarge the body slightly and change the angle. I can see where going from 50RF to CF will result in a petty steep angle. BTW, that really a nice #2!  My #2 is a wreck and will take much time and effort to make it usable. The electrolysis process outlined by 4060May will sure be useful on this one!

Keep your plowshare and your sword. Know how and when to use them.

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RicinYakima posted this 31 December 2008

Antietamgw,

Actually your explanation was very good. This is about how I was visualizing doing the project. I like the drill bushing idea, as I would not have to turn the block over to drill from the face and have to worry about centering problems again.

Thanks, Ric

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4060may posted this 01 January 2009

That is similar to how I did the No.1 Swede Rolling Blocks

http://www3.telus.net/public/aschoepp/electrolyticrust.html

A link to the site I used for the electrolysis

Happy New Year

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RicinYakima posted this 01 January 2009

4060,

 

Great site. The chemistry is a little off, but the effect is the same. I''ve used my Outer's Foul Out II with difference ionic solutions to remove rust, nickel plateing and modern blueing. The key is the rinsing and metal protection, as the bare iron will rust very quickly.

Ric

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CB posted this 01 January 2009

RicinYakima wrote: Great site. The chemistry is a little off, but the effect is the same. I''ve used my Outer's Foul Out II with difference ionic solutions to remove rust, nickel plateing and modern blueing. The key is the rinsing and metal protection, as the bare iron will rust very quickly.

I rinse in Sodium bicarbonate (Baking Soda) to neutralize any acids. The metal as you say is still subject to rusting quickly, BUT it is in perfect condition for the next step, cold bluing or brown finish.

If you are not going to blue or put a finish on the parts(s), heat the part up just above hand touch heat, about 140-200 and saturate with lanolin and ATF. This also works good to finish off the cold blue or brown treatment. Heat stops chemical processes still going on and opens the pores to absorb the rust inhibiting oils................Dan

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