1903a1 Springfield

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  • Last Post 08 March 2013
locksmith1 posted this 26 February 2013

I have a 1903a1 Springfield 30/06 rebarreled in 1943. Does any one have some favorite loads using the RCBS 165 gr & 200 gr silhouette bullets? Bob

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RicinYakima posted this 26 February 2013

With the 200 grain bullet, mine are:

16.0 grains of A2400 for accuracy 18.0 grains of SR4759 second 22.0 grains of AAC5744 third

A good shooting high speed load is 42.0 grains of H4831. But you have to elevate the muzzle before every shot to position the powder.

Sorry don't shoot anything lighter than 200 grains.

FWIW, Ric

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onondaga posted this 27 February 2013

I have an 03A3 that I shoot with a 165 gr. bullet and load that routinely bench groups 1/2” at 50 yards with the Military peep.

RanchDog CTL310-165-FN #2 alloy, sized/checked .3105” 45:45:10 tumble lube once before size/check, twice after. SagesOutdoors Aluminum gas checks are used.

W-W brass, CCI-200 primer, LOA:2.950, bullet engages lands .010" 42.0 gr. H4831SC, this load is so low pressure, you should expect slight, .010” primer back-out as I get this. I plan trying not closing case mouth flair after seating bullets, that may stop primer back-out. Hotter loads don't back out primers at all but are less accurate with this bullet. Not Chronographed but I assume velocity of 1950 fps. The LOA may sound short but picture the same ogive with a point instead of a FN and it makes sense.

Rifle was built with a new, unfired Rem barrel dated May 1942, All other parts also old but unissued new and built upon a reproduction receiver. Recoil tang and receiver through stock bolt sleeve are resin bedded. I polished the bore with the polishing method I have posted on this forum and the barrel has never fired anything but my own cast bullets....It is a shooter with USMC 3 lb match trigger and hooded front sight! Polishing method:

http://www.castbulletassoc.org/forum/view_topic.php?id=8364&forum_id=63>http://www.castbulletassoc.org/forum/viewtopic.php?id=8364&forumid=63

Gary  

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locksmith1 posted this 28 February 2013

Thank you for your help. I'll try 4831 as I have several pounds of it. Bob

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cityboy posted this 28 February 2013

2400 was my best powder too.

Jim

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R Dupraz posted this 28 February 2013

19 grns of IMR4227 and the RCBS 30-180-SP works well in my M-1 Garand when operated as a single shot.

RD

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gnoahhh posted this 28 February 2013

16gr. 2400 and 18gr. SR-4759 (under 180-200gr. bullets) have been such consistently good performers in the Springfields I messed with that I automatically go with either one every time a Springfield falls into my lap. Seldom have I had to venture far from them for best accuracy.

If I had to limit myself to one rifle in the “Happy Hunting Grounds", it would be an '03 Springfield- as long as it came with a good mold and a sack full of 4759.

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corerf posted this 01 March 2013

RicinYakima wrote: With the 200 grain bullet, mine are:

16.0 grains of A2400 for accuracy 18.0 grains of SR4759 second 22.0 grains of AAC5744 third

A good shooting high speed load is 42.0 grains of H4831. But you have to elevate the muzzle before every shot to position the powder.

Sorry don't shoot anything lighter than 200 grains.

FWIW, RicRic, do you elevate with the light case loads or the 4831?  42gr of 4831 is about 70% density or better, should not have to elevate. Can you clarify if typo or not?

Mike

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onondaga posted this 01 March 2013

I use the Short Cut H4831, 42 gr charge in my 1903A3 and have never elevated the muzzle to locate the charge. There is no reason for me to believe that the regular cut 4831 would act differently with a 42 grain charge in 30-06.

Gary

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RicinYakima posted this 01 March 2013

Mike,

I choose powders that do not require positioning, for match shooting and plinking and varmint control. The 4831 is the only load I use that requires getting the powder in the same place. My 30/06 loads are usually Remington 9 1/2 primers, or Winchester standard LR primers.

The 2400, SR4759 and 5744 loads are so small that they lay on the side of the case not matter what you do. With the 4831, the center of my groups goes up or down with the powder in the front or back of the case. When I carry a rifle in the field I do so at “port arms” position. So when I shoot those loads from the bench the powder has to be at the back of the case.

I am not up on the latest theories on powder postions and medium burning powders. I just have my notes from 40 years of my shooting, and what works for me. Almost all of my rifle reloads are less than 27,000 CUP, so my results are very different than 50,000 CUP loads with jacketed bullets the “gunzine” writers talk about.

HTH, Ric

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Chargar posted this 01 March 2013

gnoahhh wrote: 16gr. 2400 and 18gr. SR-4759 (under 180-200gr. bullets) have been such consistently good performers in the Springfields I messed with that I automatically go with either one every time a Springfield falls into my lap. Seldom have I had to venture far from them for best accuracy.

If I had to limit myself to one rifle in the “Happy Hunting Grounds", it would be an '03 Springfield- as long as it came with a good mold and a sack full of 4759.

Amen, amen and amen!

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corerf posted this 01 March 2013

I have never loaded 4831 for '06. Ill have to check that out one day. I expected you to have to position the really light charges. Thats interesting!! Im glad I asked the question and did not assume.

Do you tip the gun straight up and then slowly lower it to the shooting position?

How far is the elevation deviation “seat of the pants number” that the tip up adds to the group? An inch? More? Less?

I don't know that I have a candidate to try to reproduce the effect but I'd like to see it. Have heard of it before, Ed has mentioned it many times, but I don't recall the situation(s).

Also how fast is the high speed load moving at? Relative to the other loads mentioned.

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RicinYakima posted this 02 March 2013

corerf wrote: I have never loaded 4831 for '06. Ill have to check that out one day. I expected you to have to position the really light charges. Thats interesting!! Im glad I asked the question and did not assume.

Well, 2400 is double based with enough nitroglycerin to light easly with rifle primers, new 5744 is also about 10% nitro with no deterrent coatings. SR4759 has the same composition as all other IMR types of powder, but not coated and maximum surface area per grain/kernal.

Do you tip the gun straight up and then slowly lower it to the shooting position?

I load the round, tip the barrel up 45 degrees till the butt plate hits the benchtop, then lower into the front rest.

How far is the elevation deviation “seat of the pants number” that the tip up adds to the group? An inch? More? Less?

The 42 grain load is a 2 MOA load. The center of impact can be about 1 inch or a little less different at 100 yards. I used this load for 200 and 300 yard NRA high-power. So a three inch change due to powder position at 300 yards drops you down to 9's, rather than 10's, for the low shots of the groups.

I don't know that I have a candidate to try to reproduce the effect but I'd like to see it. Have heard of it before, Ed has mentioned it many times, but I don't recall the situation(s).

It is most common with M-1 rifles in High-Power where the fist round is hand loaded into the chamber, but the next seven are autoloaded. With 4985 in the M-1 you want the powder in the front of the case, like it is in autoload.

Also how fast is the high speed load moving at? Relative to the other loads mentioned.

Accuracy loads are 1450 for 2400, 1500 for SR4759 and 1550 for 5744 with Lyman 311284 in linotype. Same bullet with surplus 4831 is 1950 f/s. ES can be as high as 100 f/s without powder positioning. Even with it, it is 50 f/s. 300 yards in the minimum I could ever see differences in high ES numbers in scoring targets.

HTH, Ric

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locksmith1 posted this 03 March 2013

Excellent loads for me to try! Thanks every one. locksmith 1

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windischgf posted this 06 March 2013

With RCBS 165 Sil projectile I've had great results with 22 gr Rx7,11.5 unique, and 18gr 5744......x's only....

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locksmith1 posted this 07 March 2013

Now I have alot loads to work with.Much thanks. Bob

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delmarskid1 posted this 08 March 2013

There are a lot of loads because Springfield's shoot anything that makes sense when they have a decent barrel. Have fun. I love mine.

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Chargar posted this 08 March 2013

Drats...did it again. Hit the send button too many times. I need to develop patience with these infernal machines.

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Chargar posted this 08 March 2013

If there any way to delete one of these posts when you hit the send button twice. Surely there must be some way, but I am just to stupid to find it.

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Chargar posted this 08 March 2013

Addendum: I have a fondness for WC872 as a cast bullet powder in the 30-06 case. It is no longer available, but at one time it was abundant and cheap. I picked up 64 pounds at that time, so I have quite a supply.

It is a very slow ball machine gun powder designed for the Vulcan 20mm round. As a cast bullet powder it has some quirks.

  1. It must be compressed to give a decent burn without leave lots of unburned powder in the rifle. Even if compressed, expect some unburned powder.

Pour the powder into the case through a long drop tube to get it well packed into the case and then use light compression when seating the bullet.

  1. I doesn't work well in cases that won't accept at least 40 grains of powder. This stuff is so slow you won't get into trouble using a case full unless in cases up to the 30-06 and maybe larger, but I have not tried that.

In the 30-06 as well as the .308 and 30-40 cases I used 50 grains. This is a compressed load in the two smaller cases, but requires some plastic shotshell buffer on top in the larger case to get the needed compression.

This is a scary accurate load in the 30-06 and gives about 1.8 to 1.9 K fps depending on all of the variables. I have loaded all sorts of bullets on top of this load from 165 to 225 grains. The amount of shotshell buffer will depend on the weight of the bullet. Loading several bullet over this charge is a quick way to find out which bullets your rifle likes.

I have found this load to give all the accuracy the rifle has to give. This powder isn't for everybody as it can be PITA to load and you have to watch out for unburned powder in the chamber that might collect there. I blow the chamber out after every group. I use one of the cans of compressed air they sell to clean computer keyboards and the like. just a quick blast in the end of the chamber and that is it. If you are in the field, a quick puff from your mouth into the chamber will get er done as well.

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