Milsurp powder data

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Molly posted this 11 April 2007

Gents, here is some data on currently available milsurp powders that I gleaned from a variety of internet sites that may interest you, and give you some guidance.  It comes replete with the usual total lack of guarantees and warranty, and with the caution that you should;

1.  Start low & work up slow, and

2.  Discuss your needs and expectations with your supplier, as he probably knows a lot more about the powder than you do.

AL-8     This is the original Alcan AL-8 as was sold during the 1960's and '70s. A flake powder which can be also loaded using Hercules (Alliant) Blue Dot data (begin with starting loads).  This is new powder.

IMR4475     Original application was U.S. 7.62mm NATO (.308) Ball M80.  Was approved as a substitute for WC846.  IMR4475 is an extruded powder which has a burning rate similar to IMR3031.

IMR4895     Original application is U.S. .30 Cal Ball M2, AP M2, Tracer M25, and  Match M72.  THE powder of choice for M1 Garands.  An extruded powder  which can be loaded using IMR4895 data.  This final lot I have came from 1972 loaded Tracer M25 ammo.

WC680(n)   Original application is for the 7.62x39mm “AK-47” round.  This is a ball powder, which can be loaded using AA1680 data.

WC820     Orignal application is for the U.S. Cal. .30 Carbine Ball M1 round.  This lot loads at 13.5gr with 110gr FMJ projectile.  This is a ball powder which can be loaded using Accurate Arms #9 (AA#9) data.

WC820(n)    Orignal application is for the U.S. Cal. .30 Carbine Ball M1 round.  This lot loads at 14gr with 110gr FMJ projectile.  This is a ball powder which can be loaded using Accurate Arms #9 (AA#9) data.

WC820(f)    This is an unusual lot of WC820 that was rejected for use in .30 Carbine ammunition, due to the too fast burning rate.  This is a ball powder which can be loaded using Hodgdon HS7 data or Win571 data.

WC820(f)    lot #47321 is more like H110 than AA #9.

WC844     Original application is U.S. 5.56mm NATO Ball M193 (55gr) & M855 (62gr), plus Tracer M196 & M856.  Typical 55gr load is 26gr, and 62gr load is 25gr.  A ball powder which can be loaded using Hodgdon H335 data.

WC846     Original application is U.S. 7.62mm NATO Ball M80 and Tracer M62, typically loaded around 44-45 grains.  This is a ball powder which can be loaded using Hodgdon BL-C(2) data.

WC852(s) lot #47287 is more like RL-19/H4831.

WC860     Original application is U.S. .50 Cal. BMG ammo, used for the Ball M33 and API M8 projectile. A ball powder which can be loaded using Hodgdon H870 or AA8700 data.

WC872(n)    Original application is U.S. 20mm Vulcan ammo.  A ball powder which can be loaded using Hodgdon H870 or AA8700 data.

HTH

Molly

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CB posted this 11 April 2007

Cool! I got some WC844 from a friends estate, now I know what to use it for. Thanks!

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Ed Harris posted this 17 April 2007

More on WC852, this is a rolled double-based speroidal powder original purpose was for loading Cal. .30 APM2, suited for 165-gr. and heavier bullets. Much of this was sold by Hodgdon as H414, burning rate is similar to W-W760. Some later lots of H414 after the milsurp powder was gone were 760BR, which was an older 1970s version of 760.

WC850 was not rolled, but a true spheroidal powder, from Korean war era, originally used for loading cal. .30 Ball M2. This powder was associated with chamber ringing problems in the .30-'06 when the powder was oriented towards the primer leaving lots of airspace in the case. Much was sold by Hodgdon as H380. Great powder in the .22-250 with 50-55 gr. bullets. Also well suited for .300 Savage, .30-30 and .308 Winchester with bullets up to 150 grains. Do NOT load in applications resulting in more than 10% airspace. Do not attempt reduced loads with this powder.

73 de KE4SKY In Home Mix We Trust From the Home of Ed's Red in "Almost Heaven" West Virginia

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CB posted this 17 April 2007

Ed and Molly,

Thanks too. My old buddy and I just got 4 or 5 different milsurp powders out of an estate. The guy had even pulled some old Russian bullets and saved the powder in peanut cans. He labeled it, but we didn't want to mess with it. By the time you worked up a load with it, there wasn't enough to load much with. We put it on the garden for fertilizer.

This is good reference info and I'm going to print it and put it in my load manuals. Thnx again...............Dan

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Idaho Sharpshooter posted this 19 January 2008

Addendum: IMR-7383 is 50 BMG Spotter tracer powder. suggestion, across the board, and irrelevant of bullet weight: is to take a fired, FL-sized, primed case and fill it to overflowing. Level it even with the casemouth, and weigh it. Ten times, and average that weight. J-bullets start at 85%, cast at 75%. Go up in 1-2gr increments depending on case volume and caliber, and slow down to 1gr at about 95% charges. That is where it shows signs of pressure spikes.

Rich

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precisionarms posted this 25 April 2009

Hi

can you give me more info to reload the 20 mm vulcan

If you need to email me to send the info

precisionarmsinc@aol.com

thanks bob:dude:

 

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Ed Harris posted this 27 April 2009

Clarification on WC852(s)

Original application was cal. .30 ('06) Ball M2. and APM2.  Uses data for surplus H414. 

New production Hodgdon H414 product is similar to WW760.

73 de KE4SKY In Home Mix We Trust From the Home of Ed's Red in "Almost Heaven" West Virginia

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joe scarpace posted this 17 January 2010

Hi new member ned info on wc860 and wc852 for reloading would like to use thewc852 for my 7mm-08. i need to verify that i should use h414 data on an equal basis Can you help?   Thank, Joe  feel free to share with anyone that may help.

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joe scarpace posted this 17 January 2010

New member today--need to know if i can use h414 data directly with wc852? Thinking of reloading my 7mm-08 with 140 gr bullet for deer.

Thanks, Joe Scarpace

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tturner53 posted this 17 January 2010

Hi Joe, welcome to the forum. I can't answer your question but maybe someone who knows will see this.

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41mag posted this 28 January 2010

Joe,

New here myself. Two sites other than here, you may get answers about this powder are Cast Boolits, and longrangehunting.com, these are two places I have seen the surplus powders used more than anywhere else.

Hope this helps

joe scarpace wrote: Hi new member ned info on wc860 and wc852 for reloading would like to use thewc852 for my 7mm-08. i need to verify that i should use h414 data on an equal basis Can you help?   Thank, Joe  feel free to share with anyone that may help.

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joe scarpace posted this 28 January 2010

Thanks Joe wil check them out

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joe scarpace posted this 28 January 2010

Thank you Joe

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tturner53 posted this 07 February 2011

This is a two part question. First, I'd like to hear about what some of you have done with the very slow surplus powders, such as IMR 5010, WC860, etc. I have a few jugs and am looking for ideas to make use of them.  Second, uses for Data 68 which is supposed to be equivalent to AA2700. I got a couple jugs back when it was available. More specifically, I'd like to try all these powders in straight walled cases, namely 45-70 and .444 Marlin. Anybody been there? I'm looking for ideas.

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Maven posted this 07 February 2011

I've used quite a bit of IMR 5010 and WC 860, but almost exclusively in nominally .30cal. (including metric) cartridges with CB's weighing at least 160gr. although heavier is better, and always with large rifle MAG. primers.  Of the two powders mentioned, IMR 5010 is harder to measure, less clean burning, and harder to meter via a powder measure (the old Ohaus Du-O-Measure is an exception), and more prone to high extreme velocity spreads than WC 860.  However, it can be tamed by using small amounts of case filler*, e.g., powdered bran or spherical shot buffer, 0.3cc - 1.0cc depending on the cartridge and loading density.  Btw, if you use the latter filler, you should store the loaded rounds with the primers facing you so as to prevent the filler from migrating into the powder charge.

Since the burning rate of milsurp powders varies from lot to lot, it's best to start low, chronograph your loads, inspect your brass (and target!), and then work up to a given velocity.  For me that's ~1,800fps.  For the 7.5 Swiss, the .7.4 x 54R, .30-06, and 8 x 57mm Mau. with CB's weighing 175gr. - 195gr., I'd start with 46gr. of either powder.  With 5010, you'll probably need a bit of filler to boost pressure and efficiency.  Btw, my working loads were no more than 49gr. 5010 in the aforementioned cartridges and CB weights.  Ditto for WC 860, but WITHOUT A FILLER.

If you happen to reload the 7.53 Argentine/Belgian Mauser as I do, you'll find that 42gr. WC 860 + 195gr. CB + LR Mag. primers works well (never tried 5010 in this one) in the Modelo 1909.  I also found that 43gr. + .5cc -.7cc spherical shot buffer cleans up the case necks to an amazing degree v. 44gr. WC 860 and no filler.  If you search the archives of the Cast Boolit site under WC 860 and IMR 5010, you'll find more information.  However, these 2 powders weren't designed with straight wall cases in mind and will be incredibly dirty burning in the 2 you mentioned unless you duplex them (can't help you there).  Hell, they're not exactly clean burning in the bottle necked cartridges I named either unless you go to full house charges.

 

*With either filler, you want just enough to allow the CB, when seated, to lightly compress the powder charge

 

 

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Garyshome posted this 05 January 2014

Very good info here.. Now if I can find some powder for a LOW price for 223 that would take care of New Years resolution #1

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Painless Doc Cooper posted this 2 weeks ago

I'm a new member looking for any information on reloading for my Barret 50BMG.  I have experience and tools for reloading jacketed bullets, but I want to cast and load some lead bullets for target shooting out to 700 yards.   I ordered a mold from CBE casting an 833 gr gas check Postell type bullet, their 512965 design.  I have a five pound can of Hodgdon US 869.  My Barret is their M99, a bullpup design, and I hesitate to put my head next to the chamber and pull the trigger on an untried experimental load.

Any advice would be much appreciated.

Thanks,

Painless Doc Cooper

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