A paper suggestion?

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  • Last Post 25 March 2015
longcruise posted this 08 June 2013

Am hoping someone can come up with a suggestion for a paper to patch with for a small experiment I'm going to try.

I have my own castings for a .50 caliber Maxi Ball which I have sized in a Lee .501 sizer and found that it is a slip fit into my TC Hawken muzzle.  I want to play around with paper patching these and then running them through the .501 again in the hopes of coming up with an accurate set up for target competition in NMLRA slug gun matches.

I want to keep the paper as light as possible so as to avoid sizing the slugs down too much on the second pass through the sizer.

Can anybody suggest anything?

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nimrod posted this 09 June 2013

You can get some tracing paper at Walmart that works OK it needs to be wrapped wet. I also have some 9# Onion skin that works it to needs to be wrapped wet. If you find some wood fiber paper that can be wrapped dry and sized it works for some people but for me it always seems to become loose. Makes for a neat looking paper sabot though the only problem is the bullet is loose enogh to slide out of the patch and I don't like that idea. There is a guy over on Castboolit.com in the muzzleloading section named idahoron that has written up a stickie on the very subject and is worth reading. Good luck!

Richard

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longcruise posted this 09 June 2013

Thanks richard, I have some light weight bond around here somewhere that I bought years ago just in case. Just in case has been so long coming that it is now lost!

I'm familirar with Ron but have not seen his stuff on castboolit. Gonna swing by there and take a look.

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jhalcott posted this 10 June 2013

hey long, look at the “honey do” list. IS that your paper??

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delmarskid1 posted this 10 June 2013

Dress pattern paper is thin and pretty tough for it's looks. I used to use it for round ball patching with grease in my Enfield.

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delmarskid1 posted this 10 June 2013

I shoot the Lyman 330g hollow point in my .45 muzzle loader. The rifle has a 1/22” twist. I use a .452” sizing die adjusted to size all but the top band in front of the crimp groove. I change the die to .454” and run the bullets in again to apply lube. These go over 65g of FF. I only add this information in the instance that you end up hating paper patching as much as I do. The process I gave shoots into 2” most of the time at 100 yards. I used heavier bullets but the little ones worked.

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longcruise posted this 10 June 2013

Dress patterns!!! My mother had a drawer full of them when she passed. They ended up trashed cause nobody could or would use them!

My cousin runs a warehouse and one of their customers was Simplicity Patterns. Maybe she has some of that stuff laying around.

I would like to find a bullet that would patch up and shoot in my .45 TC barrel. It's 1/48 so it would have to be kinda short. I could use it on my deer hunt in October if the weight meets criteria. In CO, the .45 is legal for deer, but the projectile must weigh at least 170 grains.

Am liking this idea of paper patching for the ml, but can see that it is the tyical shooters financial spiral!!

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delmarskid1 posted this 11 June 2013

Paper patching is cheap enough. It was all the beer I had to drink to loose the tremors after a session that made me give it up. It's really pretty simple to do. It takes a little practice but like casting it comes quick once you get broken in. Where I got hung up was in the sizing after the patching. I tore the paper on half of the bullets when I sized. I never got the lubing of the paper right. I may have to revisit this as other people have good luck and them guys ain't much more smarter then me.

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Brodie posted this 11 June 2013

Longcruise; You can use just about any paper to patch with. Personally I use Morilla Brand Tracing paper. A lot of people use computer paper (green bar, the one with the holes down both sides new or used.) Plain ole note book paper works pretty good. Remember you are going to multiply the thickness of the paper 4X so use a fairly thin one. Patch wet, roll tight, DON'T OVERLAP THE ENDS, lube with paste wax before sizing the last time after the paper is dry, and use a push through sizer.  If you decide to do this  a bunch, get a custom sizing die made and size your bullets down before you patch them.  This will make your life a lot easier since you won't ruin you good work so often.  Brodie

B.E.Brickey

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Ken Campbell Iowa posted this 12 June 2013

has anyone tried that ( tyvac tyvek ? ) ” paper as a bullet wrap ?

weird stuff, almost tear proof, the good news ... the bad news is that it might be like teflon thread tape, which can leave a gooey mess in a barrel ...

tyvek ? is found as mailing pouches ... cd disk covers ...

ken

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Brodie posted this 12 June 2013

Personally I would stay away from teflon, or any such product.  We know that paper works  sp of ot ain't broke don't fix it. t

B.E.Brickey

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TRKakaCatWhisperer posted this 12 June 2013

Ken Campbell, Iowa wrote: has anyone tried that ( tyvac tyvek ? ) ” paper as a bullet wrap ?

weird stuff, almost tear proof, the good news ... the bad news is that it might be like teflon thread tape, which can leave a gooey mess in a barrel ...

tyvek ? is found as mailing pouches ... cd disk covers ...

ken

Coool idea! Good observations about it's characteristics. It is very much different than thermoplastics - worth consideration.

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delmarskid1 posted this 13 June 2013

Tyvec won't stick to itself like wet paper will. I tried it. I was going to try that gummy glue stick stuff but never got around to that.

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jhalcott posted this 13 June 2013

I've never experienced any “gooey mess” from teflon. It's always come off the bullet with in a few feet or yards of the muzzle. Every thing from .22 to 45-70 was tried. I had some of grampa's old sizer dies that had a sharp edge on them. They WOULD cut the sides of a bullet. I had a friend grind a nice bevel on the ones I kept and the problem was solved. These old fingers with carpal tunnel and arthritis don't wrap so well any more.

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corerf posted this 16 June 2013

http://www.staples.com/Staedtler-Sketch-Paper-Rolls/productSS1033694

GOOD STUFF, 8#, its the right thickness. I use it. And theres a LOT of it on a roll.

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TRKakaCatWhisperer posted this 16 June 2013

Hmmm.

https://www.hammockforums.net/forum/showthread.php?t=20463

Lists 9 different adhesives for tyvek wrap.

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longcruise posted this 19 June 2013

coref, that sketch paper looks good. Am going to drop by the local store and have a look at it.

Thanks for the link

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nobade posted this 20 June 2013

If paper patching for something burning black powder, you will find that bullets with lube grooves, especially big ones like a maxie ball, will slump at the shot and not be terribly accurate. The Lee 440gr. bullet for the 500 S&W isn't bad since it has very small grooves, and sized to .492” and patched back up to .500” or .501” will normally shoot very well in muzzle loaders. But even better is to get a mould that makes slicks. Tom @ Accurate molds can make you just what you want to fit your rifle and save the initial sizing step. Figure out how much your particular paper adds, and have the bullet made the appropriate size. As for paper, I love 9# onionskin for patching in black powder guns, but it is getting very hard to find any more. I have also been using 15# green bar printer paper, the continuous feed stuff, with good results. It is still made, though getting kind of scarce. I see you can get cases of it on Ebay from $35 - $55 if you shop carefully and a case is more than a lifetime supply. If you are careful you can use the cheap lined notebook paper also, it is the right thickness, but extremely fragile when wet so it's hard to work with. But cheap and available.

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Dirtybore posted this 27 February 2015

Think of a paper patch bullet as a tool, just like any other bullet, it has a job to perform. If you're going to paper patch a bullet, then why not get a paper patch bullet rather than using a grease groove bullet? A screwdriver is for installing or removing screws, its not a pry-bar. Use the right tool (bullet) for the project at hand. Yes grease groove bullets can be paper patched but don't expect them to perform as well as a paper patch bullet that is designed to be paper patched.

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codarnall posted this 01 March 2015

Has anyone tried parchment paper, I've discovered all kind of uses for it lately.  Sturdy cuts clean etc.   Wife bakes on it for its non-sticky properties.

Charlie

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Brodie posted this 01 March 2015

I haven't tried parchment paper myself, nor have I heard of anybody else who had tried it.  My initial suspicion is that it may too thick and or stiff to wrap well.

Dirty bore asked:” If you're going to paper patch a bullet, then why not get a paper patch bullet rather than using a grease groove bullet? A screwdriver is for installing or removing screws, its not a pry-bar."   Because smooth sided bullets do not bump up enough with smokeless powders and tend to skid out of the patch giving lousy accuracy and possibly leading. Brodie

B.E.Brickey

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.22-10-45 posted this 07 March 2015

For some reason, your post has been sticking in my mind for a few days..and I haven't shot a muzzleloader in years!  But heres what popped into my mind a short time ago:  The 19th century match shooters used what they termed a “cross” patch..false muzzle had shallow slots milled across top surface..some like a cross(+)..others had 6 slots criss-crossing.  These were for paper strips cut to certain length to cover bearing surface of elongated slug.   Heres my idea...what if you were to turn up a nylon false muzzle..could be round..nylon is springy and would grip corners of octagon brl. if thats what you have.  mill a + pattern .005-.010” deeo for paper strips.  you wouldn;t have to bother with P.P. slug..though moght be slower for hunting.  Just a thought.  Best of luck!

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jy3855 posted this 24 March 2015

I've used 9# and 16# paper for patching.  The 9# paper is in a tablet of “Air Mail” paper (weighs less, costs less to send air mail??), though I bought it more than 30 years ago, so I don't know if it's still available. If you can get some cotton or “rag” content in the paper, it is stronger when it's wet, so you're less likely to tear it when wrapping the bullet.  My 9# paper has 25% cotton content, my 16# is 100% “rag". 

Dirtybore,  I don't have that much experience with paper patching, but the bullet I've worked with is a Lyman 366408, a 9.3mm bullet that casts out at about .371” in an unknown hard alloy.  It's a grooved bullet and it shoots fantastic in my 375 Win and my 38-55!  I can't remember what Matthews said about grooved vs. smooth, but I don't think he thought badly of grooved bullets for paper patching.  Just my 2 cents, not trying to be contrary here.

With respect to parchment paper, i suspect that it won't wet well or stick to itself very well.

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Brodie posted this 25 March 2015

I haven't tried to patch smooth bullets for use with smokeless powders.  From what I have gathered from talking with other patchers over on the boolits forum :  smooth bullets don't work well with smokeless powders.  Smokeless doesn't kick the bullet hard enough at ignition to obdurate the slug and force the paper into the rifling.  When used with smokeless powders smooth bullets tend to be forced from the jacket either partially or completely causing leading and poor accuracy.  If you are going to use smooth sided bullets ; knurl them between two bastard files so that the patch has something to grip. 

I have shot grooved and patched bullets and had little problem with them.  I have been doing this because I believe that I can use a softer alloy as a hunting bullet at higher velocities than are otherwise possible with acceptable accuracy. Brodie

B.E.Brickey

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