Disgusted To The Highest Disgustivity

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  • Last Post 18 May 2019
mashburn posted this 13 May 2019

I've just been home from the range long enough to swallow down 3 cold Dois Equis brews and probably more to come. I'm very dehydrated from the heat after all of the monsoon rains and cool weather we've had. Mostly my first real attempt with cast bullet 32-20 rifle loads was pathetic. I had test loads ranging from 3.5 grains of Unique to 5.5 grs with a lyman keith style 100 gr bullet. The 3.5 and 3.7 loads showed promise but after that they looked like number 4 buck out of a cylinder bore barrel. The last two charges of 5.3 and 5.5 would have two bullets in one hole and the third one so far off that you couldn't call it a flier. I think my bunny loads may not be realistic if this continues. My Grandson is a pretty good baseball pitcher and I think even his knuckle ball would be more effective. This was fired in my Marlin 1894 CL. My next attempt will be withTtitegroup  Powder.If I don't get much better I will have to build a cage and put my bunny targets in it and let them re-produce and maybe then I can just shoot into the bunch and cripple one.

Disgusted Mashburn

David a. Cogburn

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45 2.1 posted this 14 May 2019

If you've still got some SR 4759, try it with that bullet with a good full load. It shoots quite well for me in the same model rifle.

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GP Idaho posted this 14 May 2019

LOL David. Keep in mind we bring this on ourselves. My latest interest has been shotgun slugs and so far I'm having about your kind of luck. Most of us have rifles we can cut very small groups with using jacketed bullets We chose to add the extra jokers to the deck. I do know this can be a frustration, but we wouldn't have it any other way. Gp

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R. Dupraz posted this 14 May 2019

Check bullet fit and for leading.

R. 

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mashburn posted this 14 May 2019

Hello 45 2.1,

SR4759 is one old powders that I don't have, if you mixed up all of the other obsolete powders that I have you could probably send rockets to the moon but no SR4759.That is  one of the old  powders that doesn't live here. I'm definitely not fooling with anymore Unique in this rifle. Thanks for you're response and comments. I'll be posting some more results from other loads later this week.

Mashburn

David a. Cogburn

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mashburn posted this 14 May 2019

Hello GP Idaho,

Thanks for your cheering words. I definitely won't give up, I've mastered the cast bullet hand gun cartridges and I'm going to master the rifle cartridges.

Mashburn

David a. Cogburn

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45 2.1 posted this 14 May 2019

David, Ken Waters in his "Pet Loads" book recommended SR 4756 also for the 32-20..... another discontinued powder. If you have that, Ken's data is available.

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mashburn posted this 14 May 2019

Hello R. Dupraz,

Bullet fit is good after 27 rounds fired today there was no leading. I have the bullets seated to where the lands are making slight indentions in the bullets front driving band. I bought this rifle in unfired condition several years ago and it's ben setting in the gun safe waiting on something to do. It was unfired until about a month ago when I decided to work up some jacketed test rounds for it. I didn't get very far up the test round  groups, ,however none of the jacketed loads that I fired showed much promise. If this rifle doesn't start showing me something soon it will go on the disabled list and go back in the gun safe, because I have 3 other 32-20's that I know shoot jacketed very well and I suspect they will shoot cast very well also. I know my old 92 Winchester will shoot cast. Thanks for your return message and I appreciate your comments.

Mashburn

David a. Cogburn

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mashburn posted this 14 May 2019

Hello Ken,

No, I don't have that powder. I have a good selection of powders and load suggestions. If I don't see success with any of these loads  I'm going to go back to my old jacketed loads that I have been loading and shooting for years and back the charges off and see how they work. Like I stated a few minutes ago in response to another message ,I've owned this rifle in a unfired condition for several years and finally tested some jacketed loads in it about 6 weeks ago. I didn't get all the way through my jacketed test loads  but the ones I fired didn't show much promise. I'm not going to spend much more time with it if my next outing doesn't shoot better than the Unique did today. I'll put it on the disabled list and stick it back in the gun safe. The reason that I started with it first is because of the Leupold scope on it. I have 3 more 32--20 rifles that I know shoot jacketed ammo well and I figure they will also shoot cast. I know my old 92 Winchester does.

Mashburn

David a. Cogburn

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Wineman posted this 14 May 2019

A rifle that can't shoot jacketed will not shoot cast any better and probably much worse. Maybe a poorly cut or oddly cut chamber is the culprit? Rifling not cut deep enough, bad crown, odd harmonics, poor firing pin strike, loose barrel, badly fitted wood, loose sights? Just guessing and I'm sure you know your stuff, but sometimes our beliefs make us overlook the obvious.

Dave

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delmarskid posted this 14 May 2019

I have had good luck with .312" 105g bullets cast on the soft side over 3.2g of AA2 or Bullseye. This works well in the 327 Federal too. It's about like the 32-20. Fast powders are the ticket with this cartridge in my experience. Unique was good with 120's.

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jchiggins posted this 14 May 2019

Mashburn,

I am still a newbi in this cast bullet game (I am learning though) and I don't have a rifle similar to yours.  What I can do is identify with you; I'll go fetch a Guinness Extra Stout and salute your effort.

Your next trip to the range will be laced with success!

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mashburn posted this 14 May 2019

Hello Wineman,

All that I can tell you is the chamber is good and the bore has no loose spots or etc .I have built lots of lever guns for me and  customers, lever actions and single shots are my love of all firearms, and I know how to tune one. If a rifle doesn't show that it wants to shoot, I'm too old and cranky to spend much time with it.  But, now I'm too disgusted to fool much with this one since I have 3 other rifles which I know will shoot. In other words, I'm not in love with this rifle. I always wanted one when they were introduced to the market and now I have this one. I have a lot of people wanting to buy it and if it doesn't do something it will be on Gunbroker. or to a local. Thanks a lot for your reply and comments. 

PS-You are absolutely right about all of the things you mentioned that can cause inaccuracy. There are a lot of shooters that don't have any idea of the things you brought out. If I ever get  around to it, I'm going to write a article for the fouling shot about some of these and how to correct them and some that aren't realistically correctible .I've been putting the article together in my head. Thanks again for your comments.

Mashburn

 

David a. Cogburn

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mashburn posted this 14 May 2019

Hello delmarskid,

Thanks for the good info and comments.

Mashburn

David a. Cogburn

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mashburn posted this 14 May 2019

Hello jchiggins,

Gosh your a happy, positive cheerful soul. You just cheered me up. I may go load some more 32-20 fodder tonight. Thanks for your comments.

Mashburn

David a. Cogburn

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4060may posted this 14 May 2019

 Mashburn

I had a Browning/Win Model 53 in 32-20, Ballard rifling, the two bullets that worked best with this rifle were Lyman 311008 sized .313, and LEE Soupcan, 115gr GC sized 313, I shot mostly silhouette with this rifle and did reasonably well.....the 311008 with SR7625 4.7grs vel about 1150fps, and the LEE with GC and 13grs of WW680 for a vel of 1600fps

one of the things I do for the 32-20, and I am loading for 4 different rifles, and I keep the brass separate, I do not size anything, some of the 32-20's have a chamber made with a 30-20 reamer,and .30 cal barrels.  the bullet fit in the fired brass is .310, in the 32-20 standard reamer, the bullet fit in the brass is .313, I insert a bullet into a fired case after primer and powder and use a LEE FC die to just hold the bullet in place, with the model 53 I crimp a little tighter, if I am shooting from the magazine

 

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Ken Campbell Iowa posted this 14 May 2019

mashburn ... i was just about to mention that i never met a rifle i couldn't get to shoot cast at least 2 to 3 moa ... then i remembered my remmy 788 in 44 mag ....  must have been a cousin to your naughty 32-20 ....

in and out of favor ( 6 molds, 2 squishers ) for 3 years or so ... but it's tin can range was only about 20 yards, so i traded it off with full disclosure to a guy who love-hates it just as i did.  i even offered to buy it back, thinking i had missed something ... but he is an experienced loader so it is unlikely to ever shoot well. 

i guess some of them pretty girls just never do learn to cook ...

ken 

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mashburn posted this 14 May 2019

Hello 4969may,

Thanks for you're reply and information. I like some of your powder & bullet suggestions. The combination of  the 30 cal barrel and a 32-20 chamber, was not very bright in my opinion. I do the same as you in keeping the cases separated in all of my 32-20 rifles and handguns and I neck size only, but it is a hassle to keep them from getting mixed by accident. I haven't come up with a full proof method for keeping them from getting mixed at times . I have found ,like you, that using a Lee FC die has been a good thing on my big bore cast loads I will eventually get it to shoot if it is possible, but I'm not going to spend much time on it. I have other 32-20's that will shoot. Have you ever used round nose bullets in 32-20's?

Thanks  again,

Mashburn

 

David a. Cogburn

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4060may posted this 14 May 2019

Mashburn

the reason for the .30 Cal barrels, my friend the Gunsmith gives me the 1-15 .30cal barrels that have been set back too many times for the 30BR guys, when I lined my Rolling Block all i had was a .30 cal liner 1-10 twist and a 30-20 reamer for the T/C, we do what we can with what we have, I have converted 5 H&R break barrel rifles to 30-20 this way, I have shot Lyman 311240/150gr in all three of my single shots, shot ok but the 311008 did better, I have used RCBS 30-150-SP checked with good results in the RB and H&R, neither the 311240 or 150-fn cast big enough for my Win Low Wall, lined with a TJ liner 1-20twist, needs fat .313, a couple of my friends have Marlin's in 32-20, with original barrels, one needs .315 to shoot, and the other will tolerate .313, any smaller say like .310 or less and they get some keyholing, most of the guys i know shooting 32-20 are using Unique, 4.5-5.0 grs, more is not better

I use Starline, Winchester, Remington and some old Peters cartridge cases, The Rem seems to have thicker necks, and the Starline is harder

FWIW department, the Schuetzen guys using the 32-20CPA, are shooting .321/210gr bullets breech seated, using AA 4100, with good results, not good case life though

Chuck

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M3 Mitch posted this 14 May 2019

If this newer Marlin has the micro-groove rifling, I have read that these like a bigger bullet diameter than other rifling "systems".  You probably know all these tricks, but the 1965 Gun Digest has an excellent article on how to accurize lever guns.  One known issue is on a "carbine" style gun like a typical M94 Carbine, that front barrel band, if it's tight on the barrel and the magazine tube, will cause problems as the barrel heats up and gets a bit longer. 

Just my educated guess, but I doubt your issue is the kind of powder, or even how much of it, you are using.  My first guess is bullet fit, both jacketed and cast. 

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mashburn posted this 15 May 2019

Hello again 4060may,

Thanks for the new info and I wish I had a free source for those kind of barrels. Are you using a mono block when you re-barrel the H&R rifles? I think I have diagnosed my problem.

Mashburn

David a. Cogburn

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